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Flyfisher Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: "Laptops and flight simming" 04-09-02, 08:28z  I am considering buying a laptop ( I will still use my desktop) and want to know how good they are with fight sim software. Do the newer ones with GeForce Go or ATI Radeon Mobility cards work well? What screen should one go for eg XGA /UXGA / 14 or 15" ? Is Win XP okay? I'd appreciate comments from any simmers using laptops all or part of the time.Comments from those using desktops, as well,particularly appreciated. Thanks,in anticipation. Flyfisher. 4nm NE NZGS Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

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Subject      Author      Message Date     ID      RE:Laptops and flight simming Madape 04-09-02 1   RE: Laptops and flight simming KaptainKit 04-12-02 2   RE: Laptops and flight simming BillC 09-12-02 3    RE: Laptops and flight simming AlanParkinson 09-13-02 4         RE: Laptops and flight simming BillC 09-14-02 5    RE: Laptops and flight simming AlanParkinson 09-14-02 6         RE: Laptops and flight simming jerryrosie 09-15-02 8    RE: Laptops and flight simming Vulcan 09-15-02 7         RE: Laptops and flight simming BillC 09-16-02 9              RE: Laptops and flight simming AlanParkinson 09-22-02 12   RE: Laptops and flight simming Flyfisher 09-22-02 10    RE: Laptops and flight simming Ben_Chiu 09-22-02 11    RE: Laptops and flight simming brynjames 09-23-02 13         RE: Laptops and flight simming Flyfisher 09-27-02 14              RE: Laptops and flight simming Flyfisher 09-28-02 16                   RE: Laptops and flight simming brynjames 09-29-02 17    RE: Laptops and flight simming brynjames 09-27-02 15         RE: Laptops and flight simming brynjames 09-29-02 18

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Madape Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 1. "RE:Laptops and flight simming" 04-09-02, 09:47z  Hiya FlyFisher >I am considering buying a laptop ( I will still use my >desktop) and want to know how good they are with fight sim >software. To be completly honest I would be sceptical about running any demanding Direct3D Application on a Laptop. They are not designed to run games (Although they are getting with each new release). Even if the laptop is the same speed (or greater) than your desktop PC don't expect similar performance, this is due to them using a Mobile version of the CPU, and Graphics Card (basically a stripped down version of the processor/card). If your a seriouos simmer stick to Desktop machines you'll get far greater performance > Do the newer ones with GeForce Go or ATI Radeon Mobility >cards work well? They are alot better than the older laptops that tended to use 8Mb Grpahics. If you do want to get a laptop for flight sim I would go for nVidia GeForce Go, simply down to better driver support and updates >What screen should one go for eg XGA /UXGA / 14 or 15" ? Not too in the know with laptop screens, my Toshiba uses a TFT 15" XGA, and that seems clear enough >Is Win XP okay? Yes! >I'd appreciate comments from any simmers using laptops all >or part of the time.Comments from those using desktops, as >well,particularly appreciated. I've used my friends laptop which is around 1Ghz with a GeForce Go, and found it getting 15 - 20 FPS on FS2000, just about playable. On my 700Mhz 8Mb Graphics Lappy, well lets just say it took 5 minutes to load Meigs! Good luck with choosing your laptop! Sam Harvey sam@crew.flightadventures.com **** VPC OffLine Reader Version 3.0.3.5 **** BETA 2 **** **** OLR.PL Build 1.73 **** Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

KaptainKit Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 2. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 04-12-02, 23:17z  Flyfisher, I do ALL my simming on a laptop, even when I'm at home, but then it's in a docking station some of the time. Mine isn't a new one, it's a Dell Latitude CPx 650 with 246 Mb memory and a 20G hard disc with a 15" XGA screen. The graphics 'card' (a chip actually) is an ATI Rage Mobility-M1 AGP with 8 Mb video RAM on board. I fly with a trackball when I'm out on the road (about 85% of the time) and a USB joystick when it's in the docking station. For FS98 it was great, but the graphics are useless in FS02. I can't run 3D acceleration at all and it hurts the frame rate badly, down to 1 fps when it's really cloudy, and that's impossible to fly with. I'd make sure you have the BEST graphics you can get and as much video RAM as possible. 512 Mb main RAM wouldn't be a bad idea either. I still run Win98 as it's well proven and there's a lot of knowledge about when it goes wrong....... Regards Kit Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

BillC Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 3. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-12-02, 10:51z  Hi Flyfisher.. >> I am considering buying a laptop ( I will still use my desktop) and want to know how good they are with fight sim software...Do the newer ones with GeForce Go or ATI Radeon Mobility cards work well ?...<< I have had a Sony GR215MP since July. (This is an AMD 1GHz/512Mb with the Mobility Radeon chip). I am extremely disappointed - it is in complete contrast with the speed of my AMD XP2100 system, and my networked AMD 1GHZ 'FSNav' PC. It is so S--L--O--W. FS2002 takes about 3 to 4 minutes to start up, and I get frame rates of about 1 (One !) on 'minimums'. However this FR shoots up to 14 to 20 when I press 'P' <g> Needless to say, it is completely unflyable under any setting. If I turn off the sound, then it is flyable. Not much fun, though. Occasionally the FR shoots up 70% to 1.7fps <g> > What screen should one go for eg XGA /UXGA / 14 or 15" ? This 15" TFT is superb. > Is Win XP okay? I've no problems with XP on this machine. I might add that I'm very pleased with it when not flying <g> I might add that I didn't buy it for FS, but for 'keeping in touch' online for emails/forum etc. I do use it occasionally on away missions for running FSnav when I take my Main PC with me to stay with relatives (got to do that - I have real PPLs in the family !) for which it is ideal. When at home, it is on the shelf - since I do not need to use it at home. I also bought it to assist my youngest daughter in media studies - it is ideal for tranferring DV movies, but not for FS. I haven't tried FS98 or FS2000 on it. I wouldn't recommend buying one just for FS2002, though. Not with current speeds. I always recall someone (was it Mac from FSForum ?) saying that they were overpriced, and overhyped. I tend to agree - but I still bought one <g>. Incidentally, any FS audio experts out there might be able to help me - I seem to recall some time ago (in another place <g>) that there was a 'basic' undocumented audio setting in a previous version FS - my FR on this laptop jumps up to 14 - 20 when I knock the sound off. Regards BillC -= VPC OffLine Reader Version 1.1.0.0 =- Registered to: Bill Cusick -OLR.PL v1.76- Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

AlanParkinson Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 4. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-13-02, 00:08z  Hi Bill, > Incidentally, any FS audio experts out there might be able to help me - > I seem to recall some time ago (in another place <g>) that there was a > 'basic' undocumented audio setting in a previous version FS - my FR on > this laptop jumps up to 14 - 20 when I knock the sound off. Is this what you're looking for? Channels=1 SamplesPerSec=22050 It's from the file Fltsim98.cfg in the main FS98 folder. Sets it to mono rather than stereo, and half the sample-rate of CD sound. For some time (a year or two, probably since I switched from a 2D-only graphics card) I've had sound problems with some, but not all, aircraft in FS98 - rather like the sound of the ignition breaking through the car radio, though not related to the aircraft's engine speed unfortunately. The above settings, intended to reduce cpu load, have not removed the interference. I have had a little bit of success by resampling the sound files to 11025 Hz sampling rate, but I've not bothered converting more than a few sound files. By the way, did you see anything of the airshow at Southport a couple of weeks ago? On the day before the show, three aircraft flew over my house in tight V formation, heading for the coast - their destination looked like Woodvale rather than Blackpool. They looked very much like Hurricanes, but didn't really sound like Merlins. On the TV news the following evening, they showed these same 3 aircraft doing a formation aerobatic routine. What were they, and do I need to get my eyes tested again? Alan **** VPC OffLine Reader Version 1.0.0.0 **** ++++ UNREGISTERED ++++ **** OLR.PL Build 1.73 **** Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

BillC Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 5. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-14-02, 14:36z  > Hi Bill, > > Is this what you're looking for? > > Channels=1 > SamplesPerSec=22050 > That's it ! Thanks Alan. I'll try that next time I fire the laptop up. > By the way, did you see anything of the airshow at Southport a couple of > weeks ago? On the day before the show, three aircraft flew over my house > in tight V formation, heading for the coast - their destination looked > like Woodvale rather than Blackpool. They looked very much like > Hurricanes, but didn't really sound like Merlins. On the TV news the > following evening, they showed these same 3 aircraft doing a formation > aerobatic routine. What were they, and do I need to get my eyes tested > again? Heh heh - I was most disappointed - didn't see much. Heard a lot, though, listening in on the scanner. I have one of the scan bands set up as 'Air Show', so when I heard the sounds of the first aircraft at about 1400 on the Saturday, on it went. Nice to listen to the air to air channel (123.45 MHz) every year. The winds were not kind to me this year - from the South - so most of the action took place over the Northern side of Southport. Most of the aircraft use Warton anyhow. Saw a couple of Harriers, but that is about all. Your three a/c weren't the Memorial Flight by any chance ? I get misty eyesight every time I see that formation of three. <g> Long may they keep flying. No, knowing you - you would KNOW those aircraft - sorry I can't help you there. Last year - I really enjoyed it. Since I live some 9 miles to the South, I usually see a lot of action. Especially when the Red Arrows pay us a visit. Regards BillC -= VPC OffLine Reader Version 1.1.0.0 =- Registered to: Bill Cusick -OLR.PL v1.76- Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

AlanParkinson Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 6. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-14-02, 17:16z  Hi Bill, Further to my other reply, the two lines for the config file should have a section header above them - the forum software seems to have stripped that line from my message. That should be the word SOUND enclosed in square brackets. Alan **** VPC OffLine Reader Version 1.0.0.0 **** ++++ UNREGISTERED ++++ **** OLR.PL Build 1.73 **** Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

jerryrosie Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 8. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-15-02, 12:20z  > - the forum software seems to have stripped > that line from my message. That should be the word SOUND enclosed in > square brackets. Yeah..that's something you might want to keep in mind for the future...the forum software uses the square brackets to designate HTML commands so anything enclosed in square brackets will not appear on messages.... ***Reality - The refuge of those who can't handle simulation*** Cheers, Jerry (N94) -= VPC OffLine Reader Version 1.2 =- Registered to: Gerald J. Rosie **** OLR.PL Build 1.73 **** Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Vulcan Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 7. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-15-02, 09:15z  Hi Bill, As well as the tip from Alan there is another setting you may want to check in DirectX. You need 'dxcplv8.zip', can't remember where I got mine, do a search. Run this and it puts an icon (DirectX) in the control panel. Double click this icon and then go to the DirectSound tab, on the left is a 'Debug Output Level' slider usually set around the middle, slide this all the way to the left to disable the debug feature. -= VPC OffLine Reader Version 1.2 =- Registered to: Dave Wild -OLR.PL v1.76- Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

BillC Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 9. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-16-02, 06:30z  > Hi Bill, > > As well as the tip from Alan there is another setting you may want to check in DirectX....Double click this icon and then go to the DirectSound tab, on the left is a 'Debug Output Level' slider usually set around the middle, slide this all the way to the left to disable the debug feature. > Thanks Dave... I didn't buy the laptop to fly FS2002, but it would have nice to be able to use it for that <g> Anyway, I'll try what you suggested. I haven't got the room to have it on the desk as a permanent feature, with my networked FS2002 rig. I'll try to find time to set it up and spend some effort on trying to run it in the near future. I just couldn't believe those FR readings when I first saw them - a drop of 1400% (is that a 1400% drop from 14 fps to 1 ? <g>) is rather a lot to take in. I had to rapidly fire up FS2002 on my 'fly' machine and take a short flight, in order to reset my HR (Heart Rate) <g>. Regards BillC -= VPC OffLine Reader Version 1.1.0.0 =- Registered to: Bill Cusick -OLR.PL v1.76- Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

AlanParkinson Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 12. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-22-02, 20:35z  > (is that a 1400% drop from 14 fps to 1 ? <g> Sorry Bill, only a 93% drop I'm afraid - doesn't sound quite so dramatic . Alan **** VPC OffLine Reader Version 1.0.0.0 **** ++++ UNREGISTERED ++++ **** OLR.PL Build 1.73 **** Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Flyfisher Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 10. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-22-02, 00:49z  Have purchased a Dell Inspiron 8200 P4 1.6 GHz 40 Gig HD 384MB RAM with the Ultrasharp UXGA 15" TFT screen; the GeForce 4 440 GO 64MB video card and WinXP. I am very pleased with it and have recently taken it on an extended work trip overseas where I bought a Logitech Wingman USB Gamepad. This has a mini joystick which is ideal for travel and works very well but with no rotary action so no rudders.As it is small it is ideal for travel and only costs ~$20. The frame rates with MSFS2K2 are very good as is the display and I now don't bother with my old P2 350MHz desktop . I certainly feel laptops are the way forward and although currently still very pricey will no doubt fall in price as all hardware has. Flyfisher Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Ben_Chiu Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 11. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-22-02, 01:48z  Greetings FlyFisher: Excellent! We've shifted to a similarly configured Toshiba "desktop replacement" for flight training duty and it also handles FS2K2 very well. For the price, performance, and portability of this new generation of gaming notebooks, it's getting really hard to justify buying a desktop machine anymore. Ben -= VPC OffLine Reader 2.0 =- RC 1 **** Registered to: Ben Chiu -OLR.PL v1.78- Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

brynjames Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 13. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-23-02, 14:56z  Flyfisher, I understand that the mobile P4's revert to a much lower clock rate when on battery, in order to save battery power. I'd be interested to hear comparative frame rates while running the same flight on mains power and on battery power. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Flyfisher Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 14. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-27-02, 08:36z  >Flyfisher, I understand that the mobile P4's revert to a >much lower clock rate when on battery, in order to save >battery power. > >I'd be interested to hear comparative frame rates while >running the same flight on mains power and on battery >power. Bryn, I cannot honestly say as most of the time I use it connected to the mains,however,I'll check it out for you sometime. One problem is that the battery only lasts a short while when simming at least when running FS2K2 at an increased sim rate as I did when flying in a 777 from Chicago to Heathrow.The reason I was using the increased sim rate was because one cannot use a laptop until at least 10 mins into a flight and so I had a bit of catching up to do!That's a pity as it's great fun simming whilst flying for real. Flyfisher Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Flyfisher Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 16. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-28-02, 20:38z  >>Flyfisher, I understand that the mobile P4's revert to a >>much lower clock rate when on battery, in order to save >>battery power. >> >>I'd be interested to hear comparative frame rates while >>running the same flight on mains power and on battery >>power. > >Bryn, >I cannot honestly say as most of the time I use it >connected to the mains,however,I'll check it out for you >sometime. > >One problem is that the battery only lasts a short while >when simming at least when running FS2K2 at an increased >sim rate as I did when flying in a 777 from Chicago to >Heathrow.The reason I was using the increased sim rate was >because one cannot use a laptop until at least 10 mins >into a flight and so I had a bit of catching up to >do!That's a pity as it's great fun simming whilst flying >for real. > >Flyfisher Bryn, have checked theframe rates this morning. MSF2K2 Skyhawk at Meigs Mains FPS 20-27 Battery ~29 FlyII Trihawk at Meig's Mains FPS ~34 Battery ~40 FlyII Trihawk at San Francisco FPS Mains ~25 Battery ~34 FlyII resolution 1024X768 Flyfisher Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

brynjames Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 17. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-29-02, 16:38z  >have checked theframe rates this morning. >MSF2K2 Skyhawk at Meigs Mains FPS 20-27 Battery ~29 >FlyII Trihawk at Meig's Mains FPS ~34 Battery ~40 >FlyII Trihawk at San Francisco FPS Mains ~25 Battery ~34 >FlyII resolution 1024X768 Remarkable - you actually get *higher* FPS when on battery I feel my credit card starting to wriggle...... Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

brynjames Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 15. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-27-02, 17:20z  >Have purchased a Dell Inspiron 8200 P4 1.6 GHz 40 Gig HD >384MB RAM with the Ultrasharp UXGA 15" TFT screen; the >GeForce 4 440 GO 64MB video card and WinXP. > >I am very pleased with it and have recently taken it on an >extended work trip overseas where I bought a Logitech >Wingman USB Gamepad. This has a mini joystick which is >ideal for travel and works very well but with no rotary >action so no rudders.As it is small it is ideal for travel >and only costs ~$20. > >The frame rates with MSFS2K2 are very good as is the >display and I now don't bother with my old P2 350MHz >desktop . > >I certainly feel laptops are the way forward and although >currently still very pricey will no doubt fall in price as >all hardware has. > >Flyfisher Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

brynjames Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 18. "RE: Laptops and flight simming" 09-29-02, 16:50z  Hmmm, don't know what went wrong with that message. Briefly, the points I was posting were: 1. Flyfisher has an excellent GeForce video chip. But Dell also produce the Inspiron laptop family with GeForce 2 Go chips which get much poorer 3D benchmark results, so buyers take care to check which is being provided. 2. The November issue of PCW (UK) has a review of the latest Inspiron with a Radeon 9700 based video solution. The 3D benchmark results are superb, so there appears to be a new leader on the block. 3. Top-end laptops certainly now seem to be up to the task of running FS2002. Realistically, I could do 90% of my computing on a cheap-end laptop and the extra cost of buying a top-end model instead in order to add FS capability would be more than the cost of a new 2.5 GHz desktop system, so its not an easy decision Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

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